Salina is the drag persona of Jason De Puy. De Puy is someone I first met while he was in college working on his degree in musical theater. He did book a few gigs: two runs as Don in local productions of A Chorus Line and also a role in Celebration Theater’s production of Priscilla, Queen of the Desert. The opportunity to do drag soon appealed to De Puy, though he was a bit reluctant, and thus Salina was born.

Salina is one of the cagelles in La Cage Aux Folles. That is the ensemble of queens who perform at the nightclub owned by George (Cheyenne Jackson) and Albin (Kevin Cahoon). The musical, written by Jerry Herman and Harvey Fierstein and inspired the film The Birdcage , tells the story of George’s son (Ryan J. Haddad) who has invited his girlfriend’s very conservative politician father and his wife over for dinner. In order to not destroy his shot at marrying his girlfriend, he wants all signs of homosexuality and drag queens removed, including Albin, from the dinner and their home.

A few days before opening, I spoke with Salina about her path to this show, the significance it has for her and whether being on stage in this musical is as scary as being on the runway facing down criticism from RuPaul, Michelle Visage and the judges. What follows are excerpts from our conversation that have been edited for length and clarity. To see the full interview, please go to our YouTube channel.

Q: When I first met you, you were going to drama school in Los Angeles. This was 11 plus years ago. I remember our having conversations about how much musical theater meant to you and how you wanted to really pursue that. What does it mean to you, this many years later, to be part of this production of La Cage Aux Folles? 

It’s a dream I forgot about because I started doing drag about ten years ago and that kind of took over. Drag became my own version of theater for myself. I got to self-produce, create and play any role that I wanted. Drag Race, of course, happened. The universe has brought me back into this realm of musical theater. It feels so wild to be back in the musical theater world in this way, combining drag at the same time. So it’s kind of like full circle.

For people who only know you as Salina, this truly was the dream. 

Ultimately, it really was. Being a part of this production of La Cage definitely awakened that dream in me and has opened up ideas of new dreams for me. This is actually a road I can walk down again. I’m thinking about that because people at the Pasadena Playhouse told me we’ve worked with Alaska [Thunderf*ck] before [Head Over Heels]. I was like, Whoa. Alaska’s trajectory literally brought her to Pasadena Playhouse and now she’s off-Broadway in New York City with her own musical [DRAG: The Musical at New World Stages]. The possibilities are endless, you know? 

What makes this production of La Cage compelling for you?

I absolutely am honored to be working with [director] Sam Pinkelton and Ani Taj, the choreographer. Them together are creating such a beautiful, joyful, fun, quirky rendition of the show that we’ve never seen before. Since Drag Race I’ve gotten to travel the world and visit many different drag scenes in the country and beyond. What they’re doing with this is really getting to the core of what the show is about and presenting it in a very real way that’s true to what drag is. 

You are being billed as Salina in instead of your real name. Is Salina any part of this show? Like, for instance, are we going to see Salina’s identity as part of what you bring as a cagelle?

My character’s name is Bitelle and it’s definitely inspired by Salina. Salina will be on that stage and you’ll see her pop out because there’s no denying the crazy personality that I am when I’m dressed up.

What do you think La Cage has to say about the world we live in today?

It’s wild because we had Tuesday/Election Day off from rehearsals. Wednesday we came back with the news of who had won and we are all so exhausted from rehearsing and from the chaos of the world. To have been there together with each other on that Wednesday after the election results and then to do the show; the show flourished in a very interesting way because it became a lot more real to our experience. Something shifted. Art reflects life and imitates life. Here we are putting on a production that is so much fun and so much joy, so much love, so much like chosen family, real family, love and community.

La Cage is, for me, is my version of how I would love America to be. Not even drag queens, glitter and glam, it’s more just the love and joy that we’ve created in the show is how I wish we were in the country.

Cheyenne Jackson has always been impressive in each show I’ve seen. What’s been your experience of working with him?

When I was in college and I was 18 years old they said pick a leading man on Broadway right now that you would love to model your career on. I had picked this photo of Cheyenne in his blue booty shorts and skates from Xanadu. This guy is talented, gorgeous and what I want to be like. Here I am, 20 years later, in a show with him, and it’s been so cool. He’s the sweetest and most talented and most sincere.

His take on George, the father in the show, is so funny because he’s also a father, a husband and has two kids. I used to make protein shakes for him at my gym I used to work at. Watching his father journey in real life now translated into the show where he is the ultimate father of the Cagelles…he is daddy.

Is his is still a career you’d like to see Salina have or you as Jason have? 

Yes. Part of me had let go of the musical theater dreams because I’m a drag queen performing in drag bars. But drag queens, especially from RuPaul’s Drag Race, have shown us there is endless possibility for where we will show up. Alaska is on her way there. There’s no reason why I couldn’t be there. I would love to say if there’s ever a musical of To Wong Foo, to play Chichi Rodriguez would be a dream role. I don’t know if anyone’s writing it, but that would be the perfect role for me.

If you were asked to finish the sentence, I am what I am and what I am is… What would you say?

An illusion.

Yes, but that’s the lyric.

I think I am what I am. And I’m present right now. I’m in my body. I’m experiencing what needs to be experienced. I’m showing up and I’m stepping up to the plate. As scared as I am, I’m excited. And I’m here, as Cynthia Erivo sang.

You threw a little Color Purple there. Is it more daunting getting on stage in front of an audience to do this than it is to get on stage in front of the judges at RuPaul’s Drag Race? 

They’re two very different worlds, of course. Here we’re rehearsing every single day to create a work of art. And on Drag Race you have one shot on that runway to show off something you made in two days. You’re just walking the runway in an outfit. Here I’m getting to explore and showcase every aspect of my talents from drag to my singing, my dancing and my acting. I’m very much more excited right now in this moment.

This is a bit of a RuPaul question. But if you could go back to when you had the first inklings of this is what I want to do to where you are today, if Salina today could give you advice, what would it be?

I think it would be trust the process. When I graduated musical theater college, my final performance song was Today for You, Tomorrow for Me, which is sung by Angel in Rent – who presents as the drag queen. At that time, I never thought I would be a drag queen. I did not want to be a drag queen. I was trying to be Cheyenne Jackson. To have gone today for you, tomorrow for me, as my final song, somehow the universe knew where I was headed before I did.

And look at me today. So I would say just trust the process. Step into those heels, honey. I resisted the heels for a long time. I would quit drag and go back and quit drag and go back because I’m like, no, I’m a boy who performs this way. But like, no, honey, you’re a queen, be a queen.

To watch the full interview with Salina EsTitties, please go here.

La Cage Aux Folles continues at the Pasadena Playhouse through December 15th.

Main Photo: Rhoyle Ivy King, Salina EsTitties, Sun Jade Reid and Kay Bebe Queue in La Cage Aux Folles (Photo by Jeff Lorch/Courtesy Pasadena Playhouse)

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One of South African writer/director Lara Foot’s earliest memories of being creative is of staying up late after seeing a movie and rewriting the story in her mind to have a happier, or at least a better, ending. That instinct for storytelling at such a young age has no doubt served Foot well as she has had a remarkably successful career in the theater.

This week her adaptation of the Booker Prize-winning novel Life & Times of Michael K, written by JM Coetzee, opens at The Wallis in Beverly Hills on November 21st. She uses only the first half of Coetzee’s story of a young man’s journey through his war-torn country to return his mother to her home before she dies. Michael K must come to grips with his mother’s imminent passing and find a place for himself in this dystopian world.

Rather than a traditional play, Foot collaborated with Cape Town-based Handspring Puppet Company to create a different way of telling this story through puppets.

Foot is the head of Cape Town’s Baxter Theater. She has written multiple plays and directed even more. But Life & Times of Michael K is special to her. I learned this when speaking with her recently about the play, her instinct for storytelling and whether or not we can rewrite our own story to have a happier ending in our troubled times.

What follows are excerpts from our conversation that have been edited for length and clarity. To see the full interview, please go to our YouTube channel.

Q: I love the idea that as a young girl that you would stay up trying to rewrite a better or happier ending for the movies you saw and wouldn’t be satisfied until you figured out how to do so. That had to allow you develop a great storytelling skill. How does that way of thinking still live within you? Not just with the work that you do, but how you live your life? 

I’m fascinated by biography and what you bring with you. What you bring as an actor to the stage, how you relate to other people, how you relate to family, are essentially biographies. Who you are. And when biographies meet, then drama happens. I would rewrite movies in my head from when I was probably 4 or 5. Frame by frame. Not only for happy endings, but also because sometimes I didn’t find them credible. So that is who I am. How we change, how we are affected by our context, our politics, all that might change your path – which fascinates me. 

Which would make Life & Times of Michael K a perfect story for you, because the protagonist is trying to figure out his place in the world and how to change his story, isn’t he?

Yes. I mean, he goes on a journey through this dystopian war-torn country. He works his way through this country as a refugee, which, of course, resonates worldwide. And really trying to find his freedom or a semblance of freedom. So not having to live under somebody else’s rules on either side of the fence and find a little piece of land where you can live and grow vegetables. So this is searching for his purpose; the place we can live, finding his own freedom in this war-torn country. 

When you read through the book, you must have been a little bit surprised when you came across a passage that says “Your past does not define your future. You have the power to rewrite your story.” It’s as if he tapped right into what you’ve been thinking since your youth?

I didn’t think of it in that way, but you’re absolutely right. When I started adapting it, it’s a thin book. It’s not even probably 200 pages, if that. I thought I’d do it quite quickly. I knew what I wanted to do with it. It took me so long because these layers of philosophy and so much can happen within sort of five or six lines. What to keep and what to let go of was really difficult because of the denseness of his thinking.

Coetzee wrote about his lead character in the book, “He did not seem to have a belief or did not seem to have a belief regarding help. Perhaps I am the stony ground, he thought.” How does a description like that inform how you go about adapting and creating this work and bringing this life to the stage? 

That’s the magic of a puppet – especially a puppet carved by Adrian Kohler [of Handspring Puppet Company]. You can imbue a puppet with philosophy in a different way to say how an actor would have to deliver those lines on stage. It might be not that credible or self-conscious from an actor, but when it’s spoken through a puppet, the audience leans forward and starts to imagine and engage in these thoughts in a very different way. It’s almost like the landscape of Coetzee is etched into the puppet and he into the landscape.

What is the art of getting that total expression of a character through the combination of the puppets and the actors who bring that character to life?

The most important thing is breath. So those three puppeteers on Michael K have to breathe pretty much at exactly the same time so that they work in unison. You know, I’m a theater director. I’m not a puppet director. Well, maybe I am now, but I wasn’t. I have puppeteers that are also very good actors and there’s a sense of imbuing the puppet with real feeling and character. So it takes some time.

That was a big challenge for me when I was directing it because a scene that could take me half an hour to create on stage with actors might take a full day to create with the puppet. So it’s very painstaking in terms of how detailed the movement is. Then the puppeteers understanding the body of the puppet like where do they hold weight and where do you hold feeling in your body. There’s a lot of synergy and working together, but always breath because a puppet is only alive when it’s breathing. Of course, it’s the puppeteers that breathe life into the puppet. As you let go of the puppet, it’s dead. It doesn’t live. 

I read an interview that Coetzee gave in 1983 about Life & Times of Michael K. He said about his novel, “It didn’t turn out to be a book about becoming, which might have required that K have the ability to adapt more of what we usually call intelligence. But about being, which merely entailed that K go on being himself, despite everything.” It feels like there’s a good lesson to be learned in that basic approach.

It’s really about essence, you know, and how little one needs to survive. Really cutting through the greed and politics that’s out there. The darkness kind of leaning into the darkness as well, which Coetzee always does. But I think in our play it’s the way we hold the darkness that gives us a little glimmers of hope around humanity – although it’s hard to find these things.

In an interview that gave Sarafina Magazine in 2016 you said you “believe very much in storytelling as a means to healing, as a means to integration, and I suppose some sense of a healthy society in the future.” One could argue that the society that you grew up in and came out of certainly required healing. You could also argue that the society we live in now – and we’re having this conversation the day after the presidential election in the United States – that we’re maybe globally reaching some really unhealthy moments. What do you see as your main priority in a world on fire, to develop and present stories that can do precisely the healing you talked about?

We go back to biography. I’m telling you stories. We had the Truth [and Reconcilliation] Commission [in South Africa] after democracy. It was an extraordinary thing. There’s some criticism of it. But the ability to come and tell your story and also to look into the eyes of your perpetrator, that’s empathy. That’s empathy from the storyteller. It’s one thing to say I will forgive, but, you know, you can’t really forgive. It’s not in your power to forgive and everything will go away. But you can have empathy. 

I’ve talked with some academics about maybe finding a different voice for the future where we combine academic research with storytelling in a way. That we try and articulate things differently because we have so many academics doing research papers that might be on violence or crime, war or rape. Then we as artists to do plays about that. They’re frustrated that the world is not changing and we’re frustrated that the world is not changing. Maybe there’s another way to articulate what we feel.

Michael K cuts ties with the world. He doesn’t want to deal with what the world has become, particularly after the death of his mother. There are a lot of people who don’t want to deal with the world now. They don’t vote as in yesterday because the voting [numbers were] down considerably in this country or they don’t want to worry about it because it doesn’t affect them personally. Do you think there is an additional layer of topicality that this story is going to have now, particularly in the United States, that it might not have had the election gone a different way?

I would think so. When we started [the play] the war in Ukraine just started. That resonated when we came on the stage, especially internationally. And something else will resonate now, that’s for sure. Just in terms of our group, who’s telling the story, that’s going to be interesting, I think. This search for freedom…There’s slogans from the Democratic campaign that you hear in the play, not because we wrote them in. It’s just this search for freedom, although he doesn’t necessarily use the word freedom. It’s more a concept around freedom. Free from all the gatekeepers. Free from being a servant or being told what to do by somebody, anybody. [Michael K] was judged so badly when he was a child for having this hairlip that he has to find a freedom from that cruelty.

Given everything we are facing down as we near the start of 2025, how do you think we can collectively rewrite the plot of our lives right now and come up with a happier ending than it appears we’re facing as a possibility right now? Can an artist, can the arts, help us get there?

One has to pray to whoever you pray to for empathy. Only when you put yourself in someone else’s shoes can you feel the cruelty all round. Until people can see themselves in others. It’s a miracle what happened in South Africa, you know, absolute miracle. It wasn’t just Mandela. Somehow there was a bigger sensibility or a vision. Such an extraordinary vision of what hope looked like, of what the possibilities looked like. It wasn’t just verbalized. It wasn’t just a slogan, but put into practice. Thought through.

We’ve still got major issues with poverty. But there was a philosophy that everyone worked towards and it was about goodness. It wasn’t about the other. It wasn’t about division. It was about coming together.

When I first saw plays at the Market Theater when I was 17, I didn’t know what was going on in our country. I saw these plays and I was like, okay, I’m a part of it. I’m part of making something better. So I think that it does do that.

To watch the full interview with Lara Foot, please go here.

Life & Times of Michael K runs November 21st – November 24th at The Wallis. For tickets and more information, please go here.

Main Photo: Craig Leo and Carlo Daniels in Life & Times of Michael K (Courtesy The Wallis)

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PACIFIC OVERTURES – East West Players – Los Angeles, CA – Now – December 8th

This remarkable production of Stephen Sondheim’s challenging musical is not-to-be-missed. IF you can get a ticket. I have heard that the run is entirely sold out. THIS JUST IN: East West Players has added one more week! Get your tickets immediately and/or check the website to get tickets that may suddenly become available.

Set in 1853, Pacific Overtures looks at the arrival of Commodore Matthew C. Perry and how his being there leads to the opening of very isolationist Japan.

Jon Jon Briones, Gedde Watanabe (who was in the original production in 1976), Scott Keiji Takeda, Brian Kim McCormick, Adam Kaokept lead an outstanding cast. Tim Dang directs,

Having seen the Roundabout revival in 2004, I can tell you this intimate production is vastly superior.

For tickets (fingers crossed) and more information, please go here. 

CELEBRATING 30 YEARS WITH MATIN CHALIFOUR – Los Angeles Philharmonic – Los Angeles, CA – November 19^th

Violinist and Principal Concertmaster of the orchestra will be featured and celebrated in a chamber music concert at Walt Disney Concert Hall.

On the program are works by Astor Piazzolla, Amanda Harberg and Beethoven. There is also the world premiere of Duo by Celka Ojakangas.

Joining Chalifour for this concert are Kaelan Decman (bass) Mak Grgić (guitar); Taylor Eiffert (clarinet); Dahae Kim (cello); Evan Kuhlmann (bassoon); Joanne Pearce Martin (piano); Amy Jo Rhine (horn); Jenni Seo (viola) and Ben Ullery (viola.)

Chalifour is retiring at the end of the 2024/2025 season. This should be a great send-off for a very talented musician.

For tickets and more information, please go here.

LIFE & TIMES OF MICHAEL K – The Wallis – Bevelry Hills, CA – November 21^st – November 24^th

If you fell in love with the puppet horses in War Horse or were enraptured with Little Amal, you’ll want to check out Life & Times of Michael K. It is based on the Booker Prize-winning novel by JM Coetzee and features the incredible work from the artists at Handspring Puppet Company and Cape Town’s Baxter Theater.

Lara Foot adapted the novel and directed the show which is centered on one man’s efforts to bring his mother back to her hometown in South African before she dies. Critics have stumbled over themselves trying to find new superlatives to describe the magic of this production.

I haven’t seen it yet, but have seen numerous excerpts from it and it is truly incredible. Please go HERE to read my interview with Foot.

For tickets and more information, please go here.

SCAT!…THE COMPLEX LIVES OF AL & DOT, DOT & ALZOLLAR – Mark Taper Forum – Los Angeles, CA – November 22^nd – November 24^th

Dance company Urban Bush Women celebrates its 40^th anniversary with this show inspired by director/creator/co-choreographer Jawole Willa Jo Zollar’s experiences growing up in Kansas City’s Black neighborhoods. Vincent Thomas is co-choreographer.

Urban Bush Women’s main focus is on the stories of Black women. The work goes backwards and forwards in time. The story has its roots in the Great Migration and is not fully autobiographical. Scat! had its world premiere in June at Bard SummerScape.

This 90-minute work is having its West Coast premiere and features live music composed by Craig Harris. The website describes it as a “dance-driven jazz club experience,” so music will be key here. Zollar told the New York Times this would be her final work for Urban Bush Women.

For tickets and more information, please go here.

Scat! will be performed at the Perelman Performing Arts Center in New York February 5th – February 8th.

Urban Bush Women will also be at the 92^nd Street Y in New York City for two performances showcasing the company’s 40-year history. For tickets and more information for those two events on December 6^th and 7^th, please go here.

BROADWAY OPENINGS: SWEPT AWAY – Longacre Theatre – New York, NY- November 19^th AND DEATH BECOMES HER  – Lunt-Fontanne Theatre – November 21^st

Two new musicals open this week starting with Swept Away, a musical written by The Avett Brothers and starring John Gallagher, Jr. (Spring Awakening), Stark Sands (Kinky Boots) and more. The show is directed by Michael Mayer and has a book by John Logan (Red).

This is a rarity for Broadway: a musical that is not based on a pre-existing work, but is wholly original.

The show is currently booked to run through May 25, 2025.

For tickets and more information, please go here.

The 1992 movie Death Becomes Her is the inspiration for this musical with Megan Hilty (9 To 5), Jennifer Simard (Company) and Christopher Sieber (Company) in the roles played on screen by Meryl Streep, Goldie Hawn and Bruce Willis.

Julia Mattison and Noel Carey wrote the  music and lyrics. The book is by Marco Pennette and the show is directed and choreographed by Christopher Gatteli. 

The show is also currently booked to run through May 25, 2025.

For tickets and more information, please go here.

That’s my list of the Best Bets: November 18th – November 24th. Have a great week!

Main Photo: Megan Hilty and Jennifer Simard in Death Becomes Her (Photo by Matthew Murphy and Evan Zimmerman)

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Briones is starring in the East West Players new production of Pacific Overtures. The show also features Gedde Watanabe, Scott Keiji Takeda, Brian Kim McCormick, Adam Kaokept and Kerry K. Carnahan. Tim Dang directs.

Stephen Sondheim said his musical was, “The most bizarre and unusual musical ever to be seen in a commercial setting.” His certainly untraditional show, which opened on Broadway in early 1976, tells the story of Commodore Matthew C. Perry’s arrival in Japan in the mid-19th century and how his efforts to open up the isolationist country are experienced – through the eyes of the Japanese.

Charles McNulty, writing in the Los Angeles Times, raved about East West Players’ revival saying, “The new revival of Pacific Overtures may be the most impressive production I’ve seen anywhere all year.”

The path to get there was one filled with questions for Briones that didn’t always possess easy answers. This was amongst the many things I learned in my interview with Briones. What follows are excerpts from our conversation that have been edited for length and clarity. To see the full interview, please go to our YouTube channel.

Q: We know that many of Sondheim’s musicals were not always well-received when they were originally produced, but that time and audiences have caught up to those shows. Do you think time has caught up with Pacific Overtures? Are audiences maybe more open now to what this show is than they have been at any other point?

I think so. When they mounted this show in 2004 it didn’t last very long on Broadway. I think it’s still hard for the general audience members to to appreciate something that they think they won’t get or won’t relate to because…This might be controversial, but it’s all Asian. The King and I has that really main character that is Caucasian. Pacific Overtures, Sondheim and Weidman, they wrote something that they wanted. I think they thought they were trying to be true to the culture. The music is beautiful, but it’s really something different. Even to me, I go, what is the meaning of this? I understand it better now, but I have questions.

I read in an interview you and Gedde did with Pasadena Weekly that your first reaction was one that a lot of people have; that you didn’t fully understand it and that there were a lot of questions. Having worked on it now for as long as you have prior to opening, have you been able to sort out a lot of those questions? Do you understand more about what this show is doing, what it’s saying and how your character, The Reciter, plays a role in that?

I’ve reached that. In my career if I don’t really understand something, I try to understand it the way I would and believe it and stick to that so that I can I can grab on to my reality. I think that’s what I did right now. My understanding of it is maybe different from the original idea of Sondheim and Weidman. But I’m sticking to that because I think my understanding of it is something beautiful, kind of universal.

I would assume that, like many actors, you’re intrigued by the things that scare you. How much did being part of Pacific Overtures scare you?

Petrified! Especially the way Tim wants to do this. He wanted to be true to the original vision of Sondheim and Hal Prince, which is Kabuki. And I’m not Japanese. And Kabuki, they’ve been studying this since they were children. So it’s something set and there’s truth in how they do it. I told Tim this. I don’t want to do something generic because I might offend people. But he said, you know, just find yourself. Find whatever is true with a hint of that. I think we found a happy medium there. 

You were born in the Philippines. There is a lot of dialog going on about whether people have to have lived-in experiences to play a character. I understand that intellectually, but practically, aren’t we negating what actors do? 

That was one of the things that I been struggling with, especially when opportunities opened up for Asian actors. We kind of limited ourselves after that because they’ve been saying Japanese stories should be told by Japanese people and Chinese stories and Korean stories should be… And I get that because the opportunities are so few and that they wanted it to be done properly. I get that. But if it is in English, I think that should not be the case. We’re not speaking Japanese. We’re not speaking Cantonese or Korean. It’s in English. And we can bring in our own experiences because all experiences are relatable. They happen to everyone in China and in Japan and in Timbuktu. They’re all the same. It’s human experience and we all have that and it should be valued.

What discoveries did you make about this story and your journey to get to opening night and about the character of The Reciter? 

That’s a good question. I’ve discovered about how to tell a story of an experience that happened a long time ago. And making it entertaining. But at the same time valuing the journeys of each character. And telling stories of so many characters. I asked Tim, why am I telling this story? What is the purpose of this? And then he said, Yeah, that’s a good question. Who do you think is telling this story? Are you Japan? Are you the emperor? Because the emperor back then was a one-year-old baby. He goes on to add that this story is about change and how the changes got to certain people. It got violent. It was funny. It was scary. And all of those things are helpful information to get to the finale of the storytelling.

That makes me think of Someone in a Tree, which is different perspectives on the same story being told simultaneously. Sondheim said that was his favorite song he ever composed. What about that song resonates most with you?

I saw an interview or something that Lin-Manuel Miranda wrote that one of the inspirations for In the Room Where it Happens [from Hamilton] was Someone in a Tree. There is always a a bystander looking and observing and they have an opinion of what happening. Which is so interesting because that’s why there are so many versions in history. Who is a witness to your history? Even if they don’t have a firsthand account, it’s going to be out there. It’s going to be told. That’s why I love the power of storytelling.

If we if we look back on the history of East West Players, Stephen Sondheim and Pacific Overtures are inextricably linked throughout its history because East West Players was founded by Mako, who originated the role you’re playing in the original production of Pacific Overtures. I know that Sondheim invested in East West Players and multiple productions of Sondheim’s have been done there. What do you think it means to the company, and what does it mean to you, to be bringing a new production of this musical that is so intricately tied to the history of East West Players? 

That even though Sondheim is not here, he still has a very loud voice. That he is still making things happen from where he is. He wants this because I read that he was not really satisfied with everything. It’s an unfinished symphony. I think maybe he wants us to discover it and make it better. This is what I found out about him. He is not precious with this work. Gedde [who appeared in the original production of Pacific Overtures] had stories he was telling us. He is open to two things. If you want to cut that scene short, cut that scene if you want to. You want more of that? Sure, I’ll write some more of that. He will never be satisfied with his work because nothing is perfect. Art is never perfect and he embodied that.

In the last song in Pacific Overtures, “Next,” the outsider says “There was a time when foreigners were not welcome here, but that was long ago.” In light of the elections this week in America, where anti-immigrant sentiment was a huge part in motivating people to vote for one candidate over another, what power does Next have in the show that may be different than it would have had if the election gone differently?

To me, it’s very hopeful. It came from the people who historically went, No, don’t! We’re fine here. Don’t. Don’t bring that. But because of the forceful and kind of violent interaction from the West, you can’t really stop progress. You can’t stop betterment. You can harness it, you can manipulate it. You can, you know, make it better. But it’s going to come. That is why I think even though a lot of people are heartbroken, it will get better. In Pacific Overtures, they made it Japan. It was given to them. Violently. But they brushed themselves up and started all over again. And they made it better. We can make this better. We can learn something from this. We can overcome this because we are resourceful and we know ourselves. We know what we can do. If only we think a a community, as a country, together as one, we can accomplish anything and we can be better than before.

Pacific Overtures runs at East West Players through December 1st. For tickets and more information, please go here.

To watch the full conversation with Jon Jon Briones, please go here.

Main Photo: Jon Jon Briones on Pacific Overtures (Photo by Teolindo/Courtesy East West Players)

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Here are this week’s BEST BETS: November 11th – November 17th:

A WONDERFUL WORLD: THE LOUIS ARMSTRONG MUSICAL – Studio 54 – New York, NY – Opening Night November 11^th – May 4^th

James Monroe Iglehart, who won a Tony Award for his performance as the Genie in Aladdin The Musical, takes on the role of legendary musician/singer/actor Louis Armstrong. He’s also the co-director (along with Christopher Renshaw and Christina Sajous) of this musical.

Armstrong’s life and career is certainly worthy of a musical.

He was a truly groundbreaking artist on so many levels. I hope this musical does him justice.

Aurin Squire wrote the book. Branford Marsalis and Daryl Waters did the arrangements and orchestrations of the music.

For tickets and more information, please go here.

CALIDORE STRING QUARTET: KORNGOLD’S COMPLETE STRING QUARTETS  – Zipper Hall/Colburn School – Los Angeles, CA – November 12^th Livestream Available                

Composer Erich Wolfgang Korngold is perhaps best known for some of Hollywood’s greatest film scores. This includes The Adventures of Robin Hood, The Sea Hawk, Kings Row and Captain Blood.

But like many an early immigrant film composer, classical music was also part of his writing.

At this concert audiences will get a chance to hear all three of the string quartets composed by Korngold.

Calidore String Quartet began its life at the Colburn School 14 years ago. They are: Jeremy Berry on viola; Estelle Choi on cello; Ryan Meehan on violin and Jeffrey Myers on violin.

For more information and in-person tickets, please go here. For livestream tickets, please go here.

GEORGE CABLES QUARTET “80^th BIRTHDAY CELEBRATION” – Smoke Jazz Club – New York, NY – November 13^th – November 17^th Livestream Available

Pianist George Cables, who was Art Pepper’s favorite pianist, performed with Dexter Gordon, Joe Henderson, Sonny Rollins, Sarah Vaughn and so many more, celebrates his 80^th birthday with 12 sets at Smoke Jazz Club.

Joining Cables are Essiet Essiet on bass, Craig Handy on tenor saxophone and Jerome Jennings on drums.

Cables remains an active artist and has two new singles released recently: Echo of a Scream and You’d Be So Nice to Come Home To. For those who don’t know Cables, I strongly suggest you check out these shows and his recordings.

Both the 7 PM EST and 9 PM EST sets on Friday, November 15^th, will be available for livestreaming. They will remain accessible for 48 hours after the performance.

For more information and in-person tickets, please go here. For livestream tickets for the 7 PM set, please go here. For livestream tickets for the 9 PM set, please go here.

TAMMY FAYE – Palace Theatre – New York, NY – Opening Night November 14^th – March 30^th

If you’re like me, you wonder who wants to see a musical about Tammy Faye Bakker. You then wonder who would write a musical about her.

Then you read a little further down and realize Elton John and Jakes Shears (Scissor Sisters) have written this new musical which prompted Matt Wolf, writing in the New York Times after the show debuted in London to rave, “Praise the lord for Tammy Faye…the show has a heart as big as the title character’s bouffant hairdo.” If anyone can put an entertaining spin on the late evangelist, it would be Elton and Shears.

Katie Brayben once again plays Tammy Faye. Christian Borle plays Jim Bakker and Michael Cerveris plays Jerry Falwell. Rupert Goold directs and the book is by James Graham.

For tickets and more information, please go here.

NOON TO MIDNIGHT: FIELD RECORDINGS – Walt Disney Concert Hall – Los Angeles, CA – November 16^th

The Los Angeles Philharmonic’s  annual festival of new music does live up to its name – it runs for 12 hours. Within those twelve hours is a full day of contemporary music performed by a wide range of artists.

Curated by Ellen Reid, this year’s festival will include performances of music by Doug Aitken (sold out), Raven Chacon, Ted Hearne, Annea Lockwood, Marc Lowenstein, Missy Mazzoli, Andrew McIntosh, Angélica Negron, Andrew Norman, Tomeka Reid, Gabriella Smith and dozens more. There will also be a tribute to composer Sarah Gibson who passed away in July.

All events take place in and around the Walt Disney Concert Hall.

For tickets and more information, please go here.

That’s all for Best Bets: November 11th – November 17th. Enjoy your week and go out and see a concert or a show!

Main Photo: George Cables (Photo ©Roberto Cifarelli/Courtesy George Cables)

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THE LAST SHIP: 10^th ANNIVERSARY REUNION CONCERT – 54 Below – New York, NY – November 4^th

Rock star/composer Sting is joined by members of the original cast of his musical The Last Ship for two reunion concerts at 54 Below. Tickets for both events sold out long ago. But you can live stream the event at 7 PM ET/4PM PT and catch all the action.

Amongst the cast members joining Sting are Michael Esper, Jamie Jackson, Sally Ann Triplett and Rachel Tucker.

A portion of the proceeds from the concerts and the livestream will benefit Project ALS. Aaron Lazar, who originated the role of Arthur Millburn, announced he was diagnosed with ALS aka Lou Gehrig’s disease earlier this year. These concerts are a celebration of him as well as the musical itself.

For livestream tickets and more information, please go here.

WAITING FOR GODOT  – Geffen Playhouse – Westwood, CA – November 6th – December 15^th

Samuel Beckett’s classic play is once again on stage in Los Angeles. This production, produced in association with Gare St Lazare Ireland, finds Rainn Wilson and Aasif Mandvi starring as Vladimir and Estragon – two men waiting endlessly for the arrival of Godot.

Joining them are Conor Lovett as Pozzo and Adam Stein as Lucky.

The role of Boy will be performed by Lincoln Bonilla and Jack McSherry (they will alternate performances). Judy Hegarty Lovett directs.

For tickets and more information, please go here.

ROUVALI LEADS JULIA WOLFE, STRAUSS & SIBELIUS  – New York Philharmonic – New York, NY – November 7-November 12^th

Life’s journey has inspired many a composer. This concert focuses on three different works that explore explorations of life at various ages.

The program opens with Julia Wolfe’s Fountain of Youth. By its name you know what part of life this represents.

Richard Strauss’ Four Last Songs, a powerful work, makes it clear what stage of life Strauss explored with this work. Soprano Miah Persson will sing this incredibly moving work.

The concert closes with Sibelius’ celebration of his own 50^th birthday in his Fifth Symphony.

Santtu-Matias Rouvali conducts these four concerts.

For tickets and more information, please go here.

MUTI & THE CSO – Chicago Symphony Orchestra – Chicago, IL – November 8^th – November 9^th

Works by Chabrier, Donizetti, Falla and Verdi are on this program. But what makes these two concerts compelling is the world premiere of the Megalopolis Suite by Osvaldo Golijov. This is a suite of music from his wonderful score for the Francis Ford Coppola film Megalopolis.

Audiences didn’t exactly flock to see this movie, but they missed out. I personally loved the film and have played the score multiple times since seeing the film.

Golijov is a terrific composer and this CSO Commission will certainly showcase that to all who attend these concerts. This is a score that deserves attention and will hopefully find some love during awards season.

Riccardo Muti conducts.

For tickets and more information, please go here.

ISAIAH COLLIER & THE CHOSEN FEW – Soka Performing Arts Center – Aliso Viejo, CA – November 9th

Saxophonist/composer Collier is an artist who deftly joins jazz traditions with a unique blend of other styles including soul, gospel and funk. This concert will be focused on his latest release The Almighty – a 63-minute album that explores the role of spirituality in his life and by extension our own. It’s a terrific album that should be even more alive when performed live.

The chosen few joining Collier for this concert are Richard Gibbs III on piano, Jermain Paul on bass and Damien Reid on drums.

For tickets and more information, please go here.

This concludes our Best Bets: November 4th – November 10th. For readers in the United States, don’t forget to vote on Tuesday.

Enjoy your week!

Main Photo: Rachel Tucker and Aaron Lazar in The Last Ship on Broadway (Photo by Joan Marcus)

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In November of 1947, a new play opened at the Shubert Theatre in New Haven, CT written by Tennessee Williams. That play was A Streetcar Named Desire. On December 3rd of that year the first of what would become (so far) nine Broadway productions opened. The play has proven to be catnip for actors and directors all over the world.

The economics of producing a play has made new productions of A Streetcar Named Desire more and more out of reach for all but the biggest of actors and most important directors. The result is the limiting of opportunities to bring Blanche DuBois, Stanley Kowalski, Stella DuBois, Mitch and the rest of the characters to life for less-famous, but no less-worthy actors.

Enter actors Lucy Owen and Nick Westrate who felt passionately that the language of the play and good actors was not just right economically, but also right for the play. Their production of A Streetcar Named Desire is produced in unique locations without using a set and without using props. Owen portrays Blanche and Westrate directs. They are both co-creators.

Their Streetcar Project has been staged in a variety of venues. Tonight they conclude the last of three nights in an old airplane hangar in the Frogtown area of Los Angeles. On Friday they will open in a 3-night run at an artists workshop in Venice. Additional performances will be announced for the East Coast soon.

Last Friday I spoke with them about their production, how it celebrates Williams’ language and how audiences find themselves listening and using their imagination to enter the world of three very haunted people. What follows are excerpts from our conversation that have been edited for length and clarity. To see the full interview, please go to our YouTube channel.

Q: Artistically, what made A Streetcar Named Desire the play for which this kind of setup would work? 

Owen: It just came out of a desire to work on this play and work on the character I’m playing, which is Blanche. Streetcar has been a favorite play of mine for a long time, like it is for a lot of people. And Blanche has been a favorite character of mine for a long time. Nick and I frequently refer to her as the female Hamlet. I just had a desire to work on her. And it came out of the pandemic, a dry time for a lot of creatives. We developed this slowly together out of necessity and out of what was available to us.

Westrate: The main thing we had available were these actors, their voices and their bodies. What we ended up finding out was that it’s a great language play. The characters say a lot. They tell you what they’re feeling. They tell you what they want, what they need, what they desire. And we started treating it like Shakespeare. You see Shakespeare performed a lot on a bare stage with nothing. So we started wondering what if you did that with Williams?

Q: How much of what you two are doing is motivated by the commercial demands of what theater is or how it is defined presently, not just in New York, but around the country?

Owen: Theater is changing so much. The demand for it is changing so much and getting and it’s quite expensive to make. Many theater companies rely on a star model. You have to have a famous person in one of these roles in order to make it viable financially, which is really understandable. But what it means is that working-class actors, of which I am proudly a member of that class, don’t get an opportunity to engage with this poetry. That’s just such a shame to me because there’s so many good actors who I want to see play the big, good, gorgeous roles. I don’t only want to see the same ten or so incredibly famous actors play all the same roles.

Q: We’re having this conversation a day after it was announced that Back to the Future – The Musical is closing [on Broadway] in January. It was capitalized for over $20 million and is not recouping a cent. I understand the idea behind established products like a Back to the Future. But imagine if Tennessee Williams was living in a world where only already established IP was what was performed. How would a Tennessee Williams today ever find his voice or his feet in theater?

Westrate: It’s an amazing question. I don’t think he would. I think we’re in an era [where] there’s a lot of fear right now. And so people are reaching toward something that they think is a sure thing.

Owen: It’s so disappointing for all artists personally. Every actor I know has gone through periods. Really established actors are losing their health insurance, writers are losing their mortgages, and artists are really, really struggling. Working class artists are really struggling.

Westrate: We talk a lot about path dependency in the arts, and you never change the path unless you actually try something new. 

Q: Elevator Repair Service started doing staged readings of novels like The Great Gatsby. That seems like a great idea given how much people are listening to books on tape, but it isn’t necessarily what one would think of as theater. But it feels like there is at least a desire on artists’ part, if not also on theatergoers, to not be hit with the bombast that is usually associated with big commercial theater.

Westrate: We live in such a visual age. We’re constantly looking at screens that are showing, showing, showing. This production asks the audience to really listen and it turns on the imagination in a way that I think people have forgotten.

Owen: It’s been galvanizing to interact with our audiences as we do this, because it’s been a risk for us. I’ve never done theater quite in this way before. Our audiences get to engage with their own relationship with the play and their own relationship with the characters, partially because they’re listening and their imaginations are turned on. But also, and I’ve heard this from a few people, it is partially because there isn’t the most famous woman in the world, the most famous man in the world, playing Blanche and Stanley. So they get to focus on hearing the play instead of focusing on celebrity or something spectacular visually.

Q: It’s not like when A Streetcar Named Desire was first on Broadway it had the best known actor in the world as Stanley Kowalski. [Star Marlon Brando rocketed to fame after appearing in the play in New York in 1947.]

Westrate: He wasn’t at the time. For so many years I thought that this play was about a sexy guy. It’s really not what the play is about. It’s a play about two women. I’ve never seen a production, until this one, that we have a play about two sisters. That’s ultimately what it’s about, in my opinion.

Owen: I’ve seen some gorgeous productions. I’ve seen beautiful performances. But I don’t know if I’ve ever seen a Streetcar that was an ensemble. Ours is an ensemble. It’s about four people. It’s about their relationships. It’s about the devastation that they experience together.

Q: Given that you’ve had multiple audiences see and experience this way of telling A Streetcar Named Desire, how do you think the play is resonating that is unique to your production?

Westrate: Great writers like Williams and Chekhov were writing for the future. [They] were interested in the future. Tennessee Williams has a beautiful quote in the preface of Cat on a Hot Tin Roof that “personal lyricism is the call from prisoner to prisoner, from the cells in which each of us are sentenced for our lives”. That’s a call that he’s making across the decades, across the generations. When you come to see the show, you’ll experience we’re really all just people in a room and a few people are going to speak. That’s the event. That’s what happens.

Q: Aren’t you basically sort of forcing the audience to see, not just in themselves, but in the other people in the theater, some parallels to what’s going on amongst these characters in the play?

Westrate: I hope so. I think it lets the play live right now. There’s this great dialectic between Stanley and Blanche in this play about realism versus magic, about the life of the mind versus hard facts about the value of imagination, about the value of art versus the wisdom of the body. Like there is this real conversation happening between these two people who have diametrically opposed worldviews that I think is very relevant today.

Q: You said the great playwrights like Tennessee Williams wrote for the future, not for the past. If we were to use A Streetcar Named Desire as an example of writing for the future, what do you think A Streetcar Named Desire has to say about our present, and by extension, our future?

Owen: A line is ringing around my head right now, “Don’t hang back with the brutes.” It’s a famous line of Blanche’s to Stella about investing in your better nature. 

Westrate: The line that immediately rings in my head, though I’ll say this wrong, is “deliberate cruelty as the unforgivable sin.” “The kindness of strangers” is the line everyone remembers. But there is a call for kindness and understanding. There’s a call for listening. I think the production calls for people to listen. And the tragedy of this play is watching these characters not be able to hear each other and the situation they get in because of it. So I guess Tennessee is asking us to listen to that call from other people, no matter how strange or bizarre or troubled they might be. We’re hoping to unleash some ghosts into America that will call all of our better natures forward.

To see the full interview with Lucy Owen and Nick Westrate, please go here.

Main Photo: Lucy Owen in “A Streetcar Named Desire” (Photo by Walls Trimble/Courtesy The Streetcar Project)

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Here are my Best Bets: October 28th – November 3rd:

JOAN – South Coast Repertory – Costa Mesa, CA – Now – November 24^th

Playwright Daniel Goldstein’s play, having its world premiere at SCR, is about Joan Rivers. The play looks at both the professional and personal life of the woman who made outrageous jokes and suffered enormous tragedies.

Tessa Auberjonois, who has appeared in nearly a dozen other productions at South Coast Rep, takes on the dual roles of Joan and Mrs. Molinsky. Andrew Borba plays multiple roles including Dr. Molinsky, Edgar Rosenberg and Johnny Carson. Elinor Gunn plays Melissa (her daughter) and Young Joan. Zachary Prince plays at least five roles including Jimmy, Blake, Harold and Chet.

David Ivers directs. Opening night is November 1^st. The show is recommended for audiences age 16 and older.

For tickets and more information, please go here.

A STREETCAR NAMED DESIRE – Frogtown area of Los Angeles – October 28^th – October 30^th/Venice, CA – November 1^st – November 3^rd

Tennessee Williams’ classic play has been performed more times around the world than one could possibly calculate. So there must be something unique about this production to warrant inclusion in our best bets. And there is.

Four actors, without a set or props, perform the unabridged text of A Streetcar Named Desire in unique locations. These are fully realized performances, not a reading. By all accounts of previous performances on the East Coast, this is a production not-to-be-missed.

Williams’ poetic language will be front and center in this production. Might it lead to a new understanding of Streetcar? There’s only one way to find out. 

Co-creator Lucy Owen plays Blanche DuBois. Brad Koed is Stanley Kowalski. Mallory Portnoy is Stella DuBois. James Russell plays Harold Mitchell. Co-creator Nick Westrate directs.

For tickets and more information for the Frogtown dates, please go here. For the Venice dates, please go here.

STRIKE UP THE BAND – MasterVoices – Carnegie Hall – New York, NY –  October 29^th

George and Ira Gershwin’s 1927 musical had a rocky start. It played in Philadelphia but didn’t make it to Broadway until 1930 when the original book, by George S. Kaufman, was revised by Morrie Ryskind. Many songs appear in both versions, but there are differences.

MasterVoices Artistic Director Ted Sperling has collaborated with writer Laurence Maslon to create a new version which combines “the best of the 1927 and 1930 version for the show.”

Joining MasterVoices are Shereen Ahmed, Phillip Attmore, Victoria Clark, Lissa deGuzman, Claybourne Elder, Christopher Fitzgerald, Bryce Pinkham and David Pittu.

This is precisely the kind of one night only events in New York that makes any serious fan of musical theater and/or the Gershwins wished they lived there.

For tickets and more information, please go here.

DÍA DE LOS MUERTOS WITH DUDAMEL – Walt Disney Concert Hall – Los Angeles, CA –  November 1^st – November 3^rd

Latin American music is on the program for these three concerts celebrating Día de Muertos. 

Brazilian composer Villa-Lobos’ Chôros No. 10, “Rasga o Coração” opens the concert. That is followed by Yanga by Gabriela Ortiz – a work that was commissioned by the LA Phil and had its world premiere performance in 2019.

The second half of the program, and my personal favorite, is La noche de los Mayas by Silvestre Revueltas.

Joining Gustavo Dudamel and the LA Philharmonic are the Tambuco Percussion Ensemble and the Los Angeles Master Chorale.

For tickets and more information, please go here.

LAND OF GOLD – PBS Great Performances – November 1^st (check local listings)

This is a behind-the-scenes documentary into the premiere of John Adams’ opera Girls of the Golden West which has a libretto by Peter Sellars. The premiere took place at San Francisco Opera in November 2017.

Appearing in this 90-minute documentary are Adams, Sellars and singers Paul Appleby, J’Nai Bridges and Julia Bullock.

The world premiere of any opera is a daunting task. This documentary allows viewers to get a sense of how demanding it is, particularly when you are putting a more honest spin on a part of history.

Check your local listings or go to PBS.org to watch Land of Gold.

That completes my Best Bets: October 28th – November 3rd. Enjoy your week!

Main Photo: Concept art for MasterVoices’ Strike Up the Band (Courtesy MasterVoices)

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This is my interview with Gavin when he was touring in Into the Woods. Thank you Gavin for your time, your artistry and your generosity. You will truly be missed.

Whether that’s intrinsically a part of the characters he’s playing or just who he is as an actor, Ceel is easily one of the most likable people in musicals today. Take his performance as The Wolf and Cinderella’s Prince in Stephen Sondheim and James Lapine’s Into the Woods. Even though The Wolf is menacing (in a dandy sort of way) and the Prince is “raised to be charming, not sincere,” Creel is sincerely charming and, when the role calls for it, charmingly sincere.

Into the Woods is finishing its mini-tour of ten cities with a final stop in Los Angeles at the Ahmanson Theatre. The show runs June 27th – July 30th. Creel, who played the part on Broadway, is joined by many of the production’s Broadway cast including Sebastian Arcelus, Stephanie J. Block, Katy Geraghty, Montego Glover, Kennedy Kanagawa and Nancy Opel.

I recently spoke with Creel who was in San Francisco for the penultimate stop of Into the Woods. In our conversation we talked about Stephen Sondheim, why the cast took this show on the road and about his own show, Walk on Through: Confessions of a Museum Novice, which will have its world premiere in November at MCC Theater in New York. Los Angeles audiences can get a preview of that show when Creel performs at The Hotel Cafe in Hollywood on July 24th.

What follows are excerpts from our conversation that have been edited for length and clarity. To see the full interview, please go to our YouTube channel.

Q: In 2003 you were in Stephen Sondheim’s Bounce [later renamed Road Show] in Chicago and at the Kennedy Center in Washington, D.C. What did you learn from that experience of working on Sondheim’s material that perhaps informs the work you’re now bringing to Into the Woods? 

What comes to mind is that I watched the greatest, at that time, living musical theater composer and arguably the greatest living producer director of our musical theater time: Hal Prince. I watched them in the mud. I got to watch them trying to make the lotus blossom. And if I’m honest, it wasn’t successful. Obviously it wasn’t commercially successful, but it was bumpy. 

I did this very foolish innocently enough thing of deciding that they must come out of the womb formed. These ideas must just be hatched in brilliance. And I was like, Oh yeah, this moment isn’t really that great. Sondheim can write something that’s really not that great. And then Sondheim goes, “This is really not that great. How do I make this great or I can do this here and do this, and then watch it become something that went to the next level.” To see that in front of you is very humbling and an encouraging and freeing experience. 

How would you compare the process of working on a musical with Stephen Sondheim to working on one of his most successful musicals, arguably his most successful musical, without him any longer?

It was sad, I have to say. James Lapine, on the first day of rehearsal, we all circled up and everybody and there was a space next to him. He said, “It’s odd to me that there’s a space. I feel like Steve made a space for himself. This is a bittersweet moment because we’re all here to lift this beautiful piece up and I’m honored that you’re doing this piece that I wrote with Steve, and Steve would be standing next to me.”

This is sounds woo woo, but I think Steve was guiding us from the other side. I still feel a presence. It’s a rock concert response to our show in a way that James is like, I don’t understand what’s happening. It’s crazy. I think that is definitely a testament to the show being so beloved for almost 40 years. But I also think we were guided. I think there was a spirit on the other side. The best spirit of all going, “I’m going to help.” It got into all of our hearts. 

When I saw the show at the St. James in New York in December it looked to me like everybody was having the time of their lives, which is not easy to do as an actor. How much of it is the fact that you are all genuinely having a good time?

It is really hard to fake joy in that way. Even if you’re doing a really good job of it, the audience can sniff it out. I’m personally having the time of my life. I did not expect to be a part of this. I was going to go watch my best friend Sara [Bareilles who was the original Baker’s Wife] in the concert at City Center. And then [director] Lear deBessonet called me and was like, “Hey, would you ever consider coming in?” The first time my ego was like, I don’t want to play that part. I want to be the baker. And then I thought about it. Let’s just do the job. I need the health insurance. I’ll have a good time. I’ll get to hang out with Sara again. We had such a good time doing Waitress for that small amount of time together [in 2019]. Here I am, over a year later, still getting to tell the story across the country. We are literally still having fun and I can’t believe this leg of it is going to be done in six weeks. It’s nuts. We’re very sad to let it go. 

Many of you who appeared in this production on Broadway have come together to continue telling this story. That is very rare these days for so many cast members to take a show on the road. Why do you think the mold was broken for Into the Woods? 

I think the world has changed since what we went through. The pandemic changed me. Certainly I can speak for myself of just really appreciating what you have in a new way. I just don’t think we were ready to let it go. What a gift! This just dropped in my lap. Personally, I could save money. I could work. I could see the country. I could take a breath from everything that we’ve been through. I think that story sort of whispered through the building. Gavin’s going to go and hey, you think about going on? Let me tell you why I’m going. When does this ever happen? We could actually all go together. Our show was definitely closing [in New York] because New York, New York needed a theater. We had to close, but we didn’t feel ready to be finished. 

I think one of the one of the main things that Sondheim wanted to get across with this particular work, and he said so in an interview around the time of the release of the film, was that the message of Into the Woods is about community responsibility. There’s obviously a sense of community within Broadway. There’s a sense of community within this company. Do you think that this musical offers any insight into how we perhaps can better serve ourselves by coming together as a community in our regular lives? 

Yes. I think it’s two parts, to be honest. The whole thing starts with “I wish, more than anything.” If we can acknowledge that everybody wants something for themselves then we can see the shared community in that fact. How wonderful it would be if we could help each other get what each other wants. And this musical lays that out so beautifully.

The other I was going to say is when you said that about community, no one is alone. On the surface it seems like it means I’m with you. But also I’m with you in helping you get what you want. We can work together to help you achieve your dreams. There’s always a force outside of you that’s greater than you, that is against you in some way. The giant isn’t bad. “Witches can be right. Giants can be good. You decide what’s right. You decide what’s good.” The giant is just trying to do what they can to survive. We can see the community in that statement, which is what I think the show really illuminates. It means more than just you’re not alone, as in you don’t have to be sad and lonely. It means you’re not alone in your desires, your dreams, your wishes, your hopes. I’ve got them, too. So let’s both dream together.

You’ve been working on Confessions of a Museum Novice for a while and you’ve been performing it a concert version off and on in different places. How has the work evolved since you first started sharing this with the world? 

It continues to evolve. Originally I was invited to have a meeting with Limor Tomer and Erin Flannery at the Metropolitan Museum of Art who run the Live Art series. They said, would you like to come to the Met? We’ll give you a membership card at the museum. Look around. And when you find a piece of art or pieces, anything that you’re inspired by within the building, let us know and we’ll help you produce a show for one night at the Met. I’d never been there. I was an imposter syndrome times a million. I’m not a huge fine art person. Museums tend to overwhelm me, but I went for it. 

We ended up doing it in October of 2021 with a fully masked audience for two shows and it was electric. I have to turn this into a musical. I have to expand this a bit, too. I still play Gavin Creel. It’s still about a man who’s having a sort of a midlife meltdown who for some reason called the Metropolitan Museum of Art to try to figure his life out by walking through and figuring out what’s going on. It’s about love and life and art and loneliness and ultimately forgiveness and love again.

What we’re going to do in L.A. is we’re going to do the first 45 minutes of the show to give people a taste. And then we’re going to do some covers, theater and pop covers to give people some stuff they know.

Let’s go back 17 years ago to when your album GoodTimeNation came out. You have a song on there about what Might Still Happen. What has you most optimistic about what might still happen to you personally and professionally?

I wrote that as a kid 20 years ago on the roof of my studio apartment; 250 square feet. Some of the hardest and happiest times I’ve had. One of the best lessons of living in New York in 250 square feet is you have everything you need in that much space. Anything past that is icing. I have a two bedroom apartment, thank God now, but I could live in 200 square feet if you made me. I might sell it all and just chill. My buddy Robbie Roth, who I made my first two records with, we would crawl up to the roof illegally because the fire door didn’t shut. We would sit up there, put a blanket down and pick around with melodies. That song is ultimately about heartbreak, but it’s hope.

It was a call to my future self. It makes me emotional to think about the idea of being a young person and feeling really sad but saying there’s good stuff coming, keep going. You can’t know the future, so just sit in the present. Just be. Get yourself a beer, get a friend, get a guitar, get on the roof, look out over the city. There’s possibility everywhere.

Not to bring it back to Into the Woods, but I was really broken before the pandemic, through the pandemic and after. It was just a terrible time in my life. Into the Woods was like this beautiful life raft that not only buoyed me out of storm, but it continued to lift me and set me down on solid ground. I will never forget this time that I’ve had and I just hope that we pack the house at the Ahmanson because I want to go out with a bang.

To see the full interview with Gavin Creel, please go here.

Main Photo: Gavin Creel in the Broadway production of Into the Woods (Photo by Matthew Murphy and Ryan Zimmerman for MurphyMade/Courtesy Center Theatre Group)

The post REST IN PEACE: Gavin Creel: “It’s Really Hard to Fake Joy” appeared first on Cultural Attaché.

A Strange Loop has opened at the Ahmanson Theatre in Los Angeles where it will play through June 30th. If you haven’t seen A Strange Loop, the musical is about a Black, gay usher (named Usher) working at The Lion King, who writes a musical about a Black, gay usher, working at The Lion King…of course, that’s the easy description.

Jackson did not rest on his laurels. His musical White Girl in Danger ran off-Broadway last spring. His new musical, Teeth, written with Anna K. Jacobs, opened at Playwrights Horizon earlier this year and is transferring to New World Stages this fall.

With A Strange Loop coming to Los Angeles, I knew it would be a challenge to be one of those people asking Jackson questions. I saw the show in New York and loved it, but there were things I wanted to know. Thankfully Jackson agreed to the interview you are about to read.

Of course, what follows are excerpts from our conversation that have been edited for length and clarity. But you can watch the full conversation on the Cultural Attaché YouTube channel.

Q: What has this musical that you’ve given the world taught you over the course of your five year journey, which I know is a much longer journey because you had been working on it for 20 years?

It taught me that persistence is key and that we, as human beings, have a lot more in common than we have not in common. That’s been an interesting sort of lesson to learn each time I encounter the piece out in the world.

While in New York I strongly encouraged a straight couple and their teenage daughter to see A Strange Loop. I wasn’t fully sure how they would respond. They all came out of it loving it because they saw themselves in Usher. Is that the response you hoped for when writing the show?

The show is about a character who is exploring very explicitly his own internal makeup. I feel that when people watch it, they can’t help but do that for themselves. So it’s an exploration of the self. He is a fat, Black gay man. That’s the makeup that he has to work with. That’s not what everybody else’s makeup is necessarily, but they all have whatever their makeup is. 

Why do you think the show has resonated the way it has?

I think because the show is very open and very truthful and honest – sort of to its fault lines. It says things out loud that most people don’t really talk about openly, except maybe with an intimate friend or therapist. I think that it gives people permission to wade into certain territory that they wouldn’t ordinarily do in mixed company. 

And yet they all end up on their feet at the end of the show.

I think Usher’s journey is a really interesting one where he’s so miserable for so much of it and yet, by the end of it, there’s a brief but amazing moment of self-acceptance. I think that’s a cool change to watch. 

You’ve regularly been asked about how autobiographical this show is and I love your response that it’s emotionally autobiographical. Do you think people finally understand that you are not Usher and Usher is not you?

No, I don’t understand that at all. I’ll just keep telling them that until I’m dead in the grave and even beyond then. I’ll keep telling them it’s not autobiographical, but that there’s still many people who won’t believe me.

Why do you think that is? Nobody thinks that. Nobody thinks that Stephen Sondheim is Joanne in Company. 

Right? I mean, I think it’s because there is so much about it that is personal. Usher is, you know, a fat Black gay man with a famous name who’s writing a musical. I am a fat Black gay man with a famous name. I never said that it’s not a personal piece or that I didn’t draw from personal experience. I just said it’s not autobiographical because autobiography is a specific genre. It’s a specific form. That’s not what A Strange Loop is. It’s something stranger, frankly. As much as you want to make it be about me, there’s just too many ways in which it isn’t.

If anything, it’s a self portrait. It’s an attempt to capture a kind of experience from the inside. Something that I began when I was about 23 years old. I’m now 43 years old, so I’m literally not the same person. I have a very different life now than I did then.

For the original Broadway production the entire cast was queer-identifying. Is that something that is part of what you want all productions to embrace? 

I just saw a production in Boston which was the first regional production of it that wasn’t affiliated with the Broadway production. Everyone in the production identifies as Black. But there was one cast member who I believe was like a Puerto Rican or something. Everybody in that production was queer. Not everybody in this production is. Not everybody in the London production was queer either. But they all rose to the task of the character, of the spirit of the piece. I’m really excited, as it continues to be produced, for companies to decide for themselves what the spirit of the piece is, how they’re going to do that, and who are the people who they’re going to task with honoring the spirit of the piece.

I’m not going to say that I want there to be like an all-straight A Strange Loop or anything like that. But I will say that I believe in performance. I believe in acting. I believe in the material. I think there’s more flexibility in how and who can do that. I’m interested in how far people can push it before it becomes something else.

You went on as Usher for three performances in January of 2023. What your perspective being on stage watching a Broadway house see your show, particularly when it got to the point where you’re doing AIDS is God’s Punishment? 

It was a really profound and they were powerful performances for me. I went from having lived the life that I drew from in order to write this piece, to having to then perform the piece and direct that outward. I’m the only person in the history of A Strange Loop who looked at clouds from both sides now. I’d seen it from both vantage points. I felt the loop in both directions. I feel very blessed to have had that opportunity to do that.

Getting to AIDS is God’s Punishment, that song has so many meanings to me, in part because of things that have happened in my life that influenced the writing of it. It was an honor for me to step inside of that and get to literally embody it for those performances. 

I don’t know what your perspective was on stage, but I know sitting in the audience when Usher encourages to clap along, I just said, oh no, no, no, there is no way I’m clapping along to this. Did you see people with hesitation? Did you see a divide, people who clap and people who won’t at all?

My favorite part of A Strange Loop is the moment when everyone has to decide what their relationship to the gospel play is. I clap every single time. Every time I see the show, I clapped. It’s my honor to clap. I love it. Some people start and they stop. Some people never start. Some people look around and are angry that other people are clapping. Some people are confused.

But all of those responses are literally what Usher wants. That’s what it feels like to be him. It’s to have conflicted emotions in this sort of musical fantasia. In this hate-filled but beautifully underscored, beautifully sung gospel moment. That’s what it feels like inside of him. He is directing that outward so that people can experience it because he’s been showing you his impression of it the whole time. But until you’re in it, you’ll never know.

There’s a lyric in Tyler Perry Writes Real Life: “I’m into entertainment that is undercover art.” How much does that ideal guide you whether you were creating A Strange Loop or White Girl in Danger or Teeth?

I’m always pushing for entertainment that’s undercover art. That’s the work that I’ve always liked the best. That’s what inspired me. I looked to this as my guiding light and my guiding star as I was honing my craft and learning how to make the work I wanted to make. But that work is not always going to win the box office.

How much do you want to express yourself in a way that is organic and natural to you as opposed to trying to satisfy algorithms or any other formulas that either computers or executives think are the way to make art work? 

I’m often thinking about that, about how I don’t want to sell out. I want to honor my artistry. But it’s getting a lot harder. The economics of theater are so, so, so, so, so difficult. I’m often wondering, what do I do? Because it’s not really in me to sell out. I spent so many years perfecting the thing that I do that I don’t just have this other instinct in my back pocket. It doesn’t come naturally to me. I guess that means I have to continue to push my little Sisyphean boulder up the hill and see if I can get it to the top, or if it will press me on the way down.

I read the tweet that you posted on April 8th in relation to Jerrod Carmichael’s reality show. You wrote, “Every act of content creation is an act of content destruction. Stop wasting our time. We have less of it to spend than we think.” I love the idea that every act of content creation is an act of content destruction.

Joni Mitchell has this lyric on her 1972 song Electricity that goes, “I’m out of touch with the breakdown of this century.” That’s sort of how I feel in the content era. Everybody’s on their phone. There’s a meme for every emotion that you could possibly feel or not feel. There’s this constant pressure to broadcast every aspect of your life. I have been very guilty of this, so I’m not at all above it, but I do think that everything about our lives is so disposable. And I just hate that.

I never thought that everything was so disposable growing up when I was reading books or watching movies or TV. Maybe it is, but I’m resistant to that. I want the art that I try to make, I want it to last. I want it to mean something to people and to be something that you can go back to and that it can resonate with you beyond just the moment that you watch a two second clip of it online or a meme. I don’t want to be a meme. For good or for ill, that’s what I’ve been trying to do all these years.

Langston Hughes is quoted as saying, “Perhaps the mission of an artist is to interpret beauty to people, the beauty within themselves.” How has the totality of the experience of A Strange Loop allowed you to accept that you have interpreted your own beauty and how will that inspire you moving forward? 

It’s been a real loop roller coaster ride for me because sometimes I would feel like, wow, what a cool thing I’ve made that has shown, as you say, beauty to the world. But then other times I felt like, oh, God, I made something that’s just a vehicle for narcissism and navel gazing. But then I come back to I made something that is a real vehicle for a lot of Black actors to come together, to tell a story of a person trying to find themselves and somewhat succeeding. That feels like a win. So I can only hope that continues. That there’s a will to continue to tell that story and to find artists who want to tell that story as difficult as it is to tell.

To watch the full interview with Michael R. Jackson, please go here.

Main Photo: Michael R. Jackson (Photo by Zack DeZon/Courtesy Center Theatre Group)

The post Michael R. Jackson Is Not Usher in “A Strange Loop” appeared first on Cultural Attaché.